Home / ACJ - Named Photos / Marie McDonald (Cora Marie Frye)_vlad, otto [30]

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  • historicalzg - 1Reply
    From comments in another album:

    historicalzg - Thursday 12 September 2013 22:06

    @ eastend : Well! It's excellent for an analysis, Joe :smile: Thank you! Just finished outside for the day so am going to go hunt for all pertinent to this and will put it in an album somewhere with all comments copied over.

    I vaguely remember there being an outstanding ID issue for the NEA Dorothy Gay pics. If I'm remembering correctly that there is an issue, I think I may have an answer as to who she is.. Going to look at all that too.

    Really appreciate your insights and help and I agree about the photos likely being in the early 40s time frame.

    Onwards!
    jane


    eastend - Thursday 12 September 2013 21:27

    @ historicalzg : Hi Jane, my recollection is that Johnston moved to Connecticut in 1941.

    The Kay Marr photos remind me quite a bit of the Lucille Bremer photos. The clarity, props, hair styling, backgrounds, etc seem very similar to me and my guess is the two sets of photos were taken around the same time. I believe the Bremer photos were taken around 1940... could be a few years earlier or later but likely when she was a dancer/showgirl in New York before her movie career kicked in (1944). So my guess is that the Kay Marr photos date to sometime between say 1937 and 1943.

    Marie McDonald (born in 1923) appeared in the Earl Carroll Vanities in New York in 1940 and shortly thereafter moved to California and was signed by Universal in 1942. So my guess is that the ACJ McDonald photos that are id's as such by ACJ were taken between 1939 and 1941 when she was around 17 or 18 and performing in NY for Earl Carroll or perhaps just after when things were starting to happen in her career. Interestingly, she did not want her face exposed in that series of photos, there is no clear view, so perhaps the McDonald photos date to 1941/42 when she was more concerned about being recognized in the nude photos.

    Kay Marr didn't have such qualms, her face is unabashadly visible. That tells me that Kay Marr is either someone other than Marie McDonald or, if she is Marie McDonald, posed for her ACJ photos at an earlier point when she was less concerned about being recognized in nude photos. Let's say 1937-1939. Marie McDonald would have been 14-16 years old in those years, too young I would say to be the figure in the Marr photos.

    How's that for an analysis? Best, Joe


    historicalzg - Wednesday 11 September 2013 17:53

    @ eastend : Thanks, Joe, sweet of you! Wow, Doris Day :smile: And ha! I agree with you. I woke up half way into a thought about the Marie McDonald photos so... apparently I'm working in my sleep again!

    I'll have to find what you said about that site saying they're of Marie's daughter, not Marie. Woke up thinking that the key is the tapestry in the photos. Thought they were 1930s pics but perhaps later? If the tapestry and set up ACJ used in his Connecticut studio during the 1950s shoots (like the ones showing in the glass negatives recently sold) is the tapestry and set up in the Marie pics, perhaps that would help date and then figure out if they are of Marie or not. The backs say "Marie Med" or similar but...

    I don't know when ACJ set up in Connecticut. Do you? Perhaps you can check all this out and see what you think? I'll email Bob Hudovernik and ask but he usually takes a few days to get back.

    I'm busy this week, trying to work with someone to get a privacy fence/screen shaded sort of room built out back but am here on and off.

    Thanks!
    jane

    eastend - Tuesday 10 September 2013 23:31

    @ historicalzg :

    No worries Jane. I don't know that there is an answer to this one. Interestingly, a few weeks ago I came across a photo of a very young Doris Day and said to myself, wow, that looks like Kay Marr! No, I don't believe Kay Marr is Doris Day, but there is more of a resemblance than with Marie McDonald in my view. Keep up the good work! Joe

    Delete | Edit
    historicalzg - Monday 09 September 2013 21:37

    @ eastend : Hi Joe, it only looks like I've forgotten about your Kay Marr question, sorry! I haven't forgotten it and am working my way towards it :smile: I needed to take a break from NEA for my mental health...

    Thanks for your patience!

    Best,
    jane
  • historicalzg - 1Reply
    Got called away so don't have all old comments added. Marie McDonald was originally ID'd as Betty Marr. When that was corrected to the above, then the first pic in here also became Marie McDonald.

    Would have been Betty Marr as otto said if the ID of the others as Betty Marr hadn't been incorrect.

    Will finish this and the album on Marie McDonald / Kay Marr tomorrow. Hopefully.

    Best,
    jane
  • historicalzg - 1Reply
    @ otto : You read my mind, otto :smile: I was just trying to figure out what to do about these. But no brain cells left tonight. Will try to pick it up tomorrow.

    That is the exact reason why there needs to be some thread of consistency!

    Appreciate all the help. Best, jane
  • otto - 1Reply
    Here missing "zr 170k_KA59", I still believe it is the same model, the subject of heated discussion with Vlad.
    I have no tools to say that all the images depict Marie McDonald, Cora Marie Frye, Kay Marr, (Marked Jean Vollemar and) ... etc.

    ???

    otto
  • historicalzg - 1Reply
    Otto, I haven't lost your input/question on one of the pics re: Betty Marr not Marie. I just haven't gotten to add it yet.

    I'm still trying to track all the changes for these pics. Must take a break from Betty and Marie before my head explodes :smile:

    Will move on to something easy till tomorrow morning.

    jane

ACJohnston. Marie McDonald.    Jan 7, '13 11:23 PM
by Vlad for group historicalziegfeld #685

Marie McDonald (Cora Marie Frye)

After reviewing all comments on these pics across multiple albums on both HZ and HZG, I think the question of the first pic being Betty Marr or not arose due to the mis-ID of Marie McDonald as Betty Marr since all the others here were ID'd as Betty Marr at first. Which is why this did not look like Betty Marr.

http://historicalzg.piwigo.com/index?/category/400-acj_id_betty_marr_vlad

ohikkoshi wrote Oct 12, '11
Betty Marr, of course.
...was Marie McDonald (Cora Marie Frye).

Am I right in coming to that conclusion, otto?

Thanks, jane

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